[0:00] Hello, friends. Welcome to another episode of Tell Us a Good Story. Today is another one of those bucket list type moments for us. Our next guest is a 16-time New York Times bestselling author and is considered to be one of the top three leadership speakers in the world, Mr. John Gordon. You guys, if you’re not familiar with John, you’ve probably seen one of his books on the shelves at the airport or at any bookstore near you. However, we found out that wasn’t always the case. In this conversation, John was really open about the things he struggled with earlier in his career and in his marriage, from his wife giving him an ultimatum to change, to almost going bankrupt, to him eventually writing the Energy Bus book that was then rejected by 30 publishers. And the story of how John turned to God and would take daily prayer walks to get through the toughest, most challenging times of his life. Folks, this was such a blessing for us to be able to talk to this man. You guys, we can’t wait for here, this amazing conversation with John Gordon. I’m Kevin. And I’m Stephanie. And during our marriage, we have dealt with an electrocution, a brain tumor, brain surgery. Then doctors telling us that children were not in our future, followed by miscarriage, and then Kevin’s cancer diagnosis. However, today we live a life completely healed and restored with three healthy children who doctors said were not possible. And we’re here to tell stories that inspire, give hope, and brighten your day. Welcome to… Tell Us a Good Story.

[1:25] Okay, friends, before we get to this episode, just a friendly reminder to please hit the subscribe button on YouTube and Apple podcast or give us a review. Five stars, please. In our world, this is super, super important because it will help with the algorithm to make it easier for people to find us. And thank you for sharing our post across your social media. That really helps with engagement and with us getting guests. Yes. So, hey, if you want us to keep working our way up to talking to Chip and Joanna, please share us with your friends. But regardless, thank you for listening to tell us a good story.

[1:57] All right, Steph. Are you freaking out right now? You have been wanting to talk to him for so long. We’re very excited about this. You are so calm right now. You’re like, I’m so excited. No, you’re freaking out about this. Well, friends, our next guest is a husband, father, and author. He is a 15-time bestselling author, including the books The Energy Bus, The Carpenter, and Training Camp. And he is considered to be one of the top three leadership authors and speakers in the world. Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to Tell Us a Good Story, Mr. John Gordon. John Gordon’s here!

[2:29] What a great intro. Oh, we’re so excited, John. Thank you for saying yes to us, sir. We’re excited to talk to you. And first off, John, you went to Cornell, very prestigious Ivy League school in Ithaca, New York. Steph and i and our family are actually going to ithaca next weekend for about four days first time we’ve ever gone there with with some friends so before we go is there a john gordon statue somewhere is there a john gordon sign that we need to get a family photo in from yes what is in ithaca north that we should go see not at all there’s no stop to me whatsoever and i often think you know as a lacrosse player at cornell there’s no way i’m in the hall of fame either the only way I would make it there would be as a writer. So that’s not happening. But Ithaca is really known for beautiful lakes and the gorges. And it’s really beautiful, really nice, great winery. So you’re going to enjoy it. I’m just wondering why you’re going there. Why are you going to Ithaca? John, I feel the same way. Honestly, I feel the same way. Our best friends have wanted to take us for like, I think ever since we were like newly married. Yeah, he went to school at cornell and he just talked about the gorges there and the lakes and hopefully we can keep our six year old away from jumping off into some of this water so i’ve ever wanted to leash a child.

[3:51] Yes i understand the leashes now for this situation yeah hold the child’s hand for sure yeah but yeah it is beautiful it is majestic i’d love to go in there, The wintertime was rough, so it was not fun in the wintertime. It was so cold in college. That’s why I moved to Florida after college. I’m like, I’m going to the warm weather and some sunshine. I totally get that. I have a question for you. You are known for being so positive. Where did that positivity come from in your life? Did a situation happen or you just mentally one day woke up and you’re like, I’m done being all doom and gloom? Yeah, it’s so interesting because I’m not naturally positive. So this is my life’s work. And yet I naturally go towards the negative. I grew up in a Jewish Italian family, a lot of food, a lot of guilt, a lot of wine, a lot of whining. When I started speaking, my dad said, I can’t believe people actually pay you to speak. When you’re a kid, we paid you to shut up. And that’s how, that’s how it was for my house. But I gradually, you know, was dealing with more and more negativity, fear, anxiety, depression.

[4:59] And I lost my job during the dot-com crash. And my wife threatened to leave me during that time because I was being so negative, so miserable. I’m blaming her for why I had not lived up to my potential.

[5:10] And she said, if you don’t change, we’re over. So that was a huge wake-up call for me. And I wanted to change. I wanted to be a better husband. And that really got me into researching ways that I could be more positive. I began to study some new emerging ideas from positive psychology. This is all the way back in 2001. No one was talking about these ideas and concepts back then. And so I began practicing some ideas. I began taking a thank you walk every day. I began to celebrate my successes at night. I began to train my mind to be more positive. And I would take these daily walks and I would do this work day in and day out. And then I began writing a weekly positive tip.

[5:52] On strategies I was doing. And I was sharing those now with others and benefiting them.

[5:57] And that led me to actually do this work as a writer and speaker. So it was actually out of my own challenges, my own struggles that made me want to be more positive. And I think that’s why I’m a good teacher because I know what it’s like to struggle like so many do with negativity. And I know what it takes to become more positive. And here’s the great news. We can all elevate our state of mind. We can all elevate our positivity. And it’s not just a nice way to lead. It’s not just something that’s Pollyanna. You literally can elevate your mind and change the way you think and the way you think changes everything. So that’s why this is so important. That is so, so good. Okay. Okay. You wrote one of your best known books is the energy bus. And you were just talking about how you were struggling. Well,

[6:45] John, this morning we had a daughter who’s on the struggle bus. We needed her on the energy bus. So as you were raising your kids and they went on the struggle bus, how did you elevate them? Yes. You know, get them to think positively, speak positively. How did you train the kids to have that mindset, John?

[7:05] You know, it’s, it’s not easy. And we did struggle with it because my son would be more on the negative side. Like me, my daughter was generally more positive, but now she struggles at times. She’s actually a speaker. And whenever she’s on the road going to speak, she’s always encountering some adversity, right? Some challenge. I’m telling you, this girl goes through the fire. And I told her, that’s what you have to do as a speaker. You go through all these issues, all these challenges, the planes don’t work. The mics don’t work. The audiences are challenging. and it’s like, do you really want to do this work? Are you really going to make a difference? Are you doing it for the right reason? So it will refine you. It will test you. And she’s learning that now. So I’m encouraging her. I encourage my son a lot. I’m really a natural encourager. So even though I might not be positive myself at times, which, you know, again, I become more positive. I love to encourage others. So I would really encourage them. And then we did a practice where I would ask them their success of the day. I created a success journal. And every night we would talk about what went right that day. The one thing that they feel proud of, the one great accomplishment, the one great conversation, the one thing that made them smile. And every day you go to bed, a success.

[8:16] You wake up, a success. And so now you are looking for the successes in your life. And we know that what we look for, we find. What we focus on shows up more in our lives. So the more that we do this, it literally changes, again, the way our brain’s wired inspired and allows us to focus more on positivity versus the negativity. And you build more confidence as a result of that. So I think it’s probably one of the best things I did as a dad was that I did a lot of things that were wrong along the way, like talking about the game too much after the game when they were, I’m guilty. I definitely made that mistake.

[8:51] I admit that, but, but I also did some things right. Thankfully.

[8:54] Yes. You beautiful family. When you look on Instagram, you obviously did something. Yes, you did. Well, that’s it. My wife gets all the credit it for that smart man john the good answer all right steph i’ve got a question for you, what’s your favorite book of all time uh obviously you met her where oh i thought you’re gonna say the bible oh oops, what’s your second favorite book of all time you met her where, a distant second totally distant it’s a pretty good book sorry god it’s still a pretty good book But we’re so excited. Where can people get our book? Okay, I know this. Amazon.com. Yes. Barnes & Noble. Yes, and? And our website, KevinandSteph.com. And what happens if they buy it off our website? What do they get? Uh, an autograph from us. Yes. Who wouldn’t want that? So listeners, if you’ve already read the book, thank you so much. We’ve had such good feedback. One thing that helps us, if you can give us a review on amazon.com, we would greatly appreciate it. Thank you so much. And thank you for listening.

[10:04] All right, John, for all of our guests, I like to give a list of fun facts to let listeners know what you’ve done, what you’ve accomplished. And Steph is not aware of any of these okay so you’re gonna see her genuine reaction to this and if i’m off on any of this john please correct me but this should spurn some fun stories all right okay yep fun fact number one john has a pickleball court named after him most people have things named after them when they die.

[10:31] Not this guy all right so our friend damon west who we interviewed about a year year and a half built a pickleball court in his backyard and named it after john so two-part question here john first off how do you find out that you have a court named after you do you just show up to play and you’re like oh my gosh like what is this and two how do i get something named after me whether it’s a court a building a baby how does this work john that is so funny that you said that i don’t have I have a statue named after me at Cornell, but I have a thinker ball named after me in Beaumont, Texas at Damon’s house. Yes. So Damon and I wrote The Coffee Bean together. And I came to him with the idea because Dabo Sweeney told me how Damon had just given a talk to Clemson and how he inspired the team with this coffee bean message. And once he said what a coffee bean was all about, I’m like, oh, man, that needs to be a book. I had a vision for it right away. way. Cause I had always been talking about the power is on the inside, not outside. And the coffee bean messages, you have the power inside to transform your world on the outside. And so when Dabble told me that I reached out to Damon, I said, Hey, we should do a book. Damon said, you don’t need me for that. You’re John Gordon. You can do this on your own. I said, yeah, I know, but we’re supposed to do it together. I just have this feeling that we are.

[11:55] And yes, I could have made a lot more money doing it on my own, but I gave Damon, you know, half the book, half the royalties, everything. And so he went forward with this concept, started giving a lot of talks, and now he’s been crushing it as a speaker, as a writer. So this book really put him on the map and helped him build this new, great, amazing house. And so, Kevin, the way you actually get a pickleball, you know, court named after you is you’ve got to give someone a book that they could write.

[12:27] You got to help them make millions of dollars and then build a big house and then a pickleball court. And then they appreciate you. And here’s what’s great about Damon. He appreciates it so much and is thankful he’s not arrogant. And then he’s done the most with it. And now he’s impacting so many lives as well. So both of us are out there impacting tens of thousands of people every month, hundreds of thousands if not more every year and and we’re just on a mission so so yeah it was cool to have a pickleball court named after me he reached out to me said he was doing that and uh yeah i was i was i was thankful i mean i don’t get jazzed by statues or stadiums or if someone said we’re gonna name this after you it really wouldn’t do a lot for me to me my legacy is is I want to leave it in people. That’s what matters most is the impact I have in people. That’s what fires me up. Statues do not get me excited, but I am excited about playing on this pickleball court, even though I haven’t yet. So I’ve got this pickleball court with my name on it and I have it. And I often think about his relatives or friends that come over like, why do you have a court named John Gordon Pickleball Court? What is that all about?

[13:42] Well, I’m sure they probably know by now. They for sure know. The impact you had on his life.

[13:47] It’s funny and special. It’s funny. Yes. Yeah. All right, Steph. Next fun fact. John opened one of the very first Moe’s Southwest Grill restaurants in the US. Yes. I didn’t know that. And then eventually sold it to focus on writing and speaking. However, his wife said, but you’re not good at writing and speaking. So, John, can you share the story of how you basically made a complete career change, right? but can you talk about what led to that, John? Because that’s an incredible story. Kevin, you have done your homework. I am really impressed with your background information. You should go work for the FBI.

[14:27] Well, thank you. So I opened up the fifth Moe’s in the entire country. We were the first Moe’s in Florida. We had just moved to Jacksonville, Florida from Atlanta. It was when I lost that job during the dot-com crash and I was crumbling, didn’t know how I was going to pay the bills. And I had been in the restaurant business in Atlanta since I was 24 years old, got out of it at like 29, 30. We moved down to Jacksonville and I’m thinking, how am I going to pay the bills? How will I support my family? I’m almost bankrupt. I’m almost literally about to lose everything. And I said, let me get back in the restaurant business. this. I knew of the concept Moe’s from Atlanta. I thought, okay, that’s a great concept. I think it might work here. I second mortgaged my home. 20,000 credit cards. And I opened up that first Moe’s Southwest Grill in Jacksonville. And people were walking in the door and we were yelling welcome to Moe’s and they walked out. Really? They thought we were saying we’re closed. Oh no!

[15:28] Yeah, yeah. And so we would grab them and bring them back in and then gradually we started to develop a following. I advertised to the radio with our first amount of money we made. It wasn’t even a profit, but it was just a little bit extra money. And we put it into radio. And then all of a sudden things started to happen for us and we started to grow. It was a really special time in my life in terms of faith, because I was so full of fear and I was praying a lot. And I just saw God work miracles to support me, my family, and not have us go under during that time because it was pretty scary. It was during that time that I knew I wanted to write and speak and I knew that was my calling. So the goal was make enough money with the restaurant to allow me to write and speak. So there I am wiping tables down every day. I’ve got my crew making the burritos. I’m talking to customers. I’m going out trying to build business with caterings and we’re flying the movie theater. My wife and I were doing this together. It’s amazing what you’ll do and your family’s future is on the line.

[16:29] And I was just doing that over and over again, just trying to make it happen somehow, some way. I remember we made our first profit, eventually started to do better and better. And I said, okay, I now really want to try to write and speak and do this and go after this. And my first speaking engagement came when a woman was in the Moe’s and I’m wiping tables down. I start talking to her. It turns out she’s the managing partner of New York Life right near the Moe’s. And I said, you know, I’m also a motivational speaker. I had yet to give one talk but i was a motivational speaker and she said well come speak to my my company my agents i said okay i try to get out of it because i got so nervous and scared she said no no you agreed to do this we’re ready for you we are expecting you i’m like all right fine i went i gave a talk on success is about the little things and then talked about no energy vampires suppliers aloud because I had, I thought I came up with that term. If I didn’t come up with, I popularized it and then talked about that. And then from that moment on, I’m like, you know, I think I could do this. It went really well. I enjoyed it. They laughed. I was sharing information. I’m like, okay, I think I can do this. And gave about 80 free talks after that.

[17:46] And then that began my career as a writer and speaker. And I know tens of thousands of talks and groups and organizations and speeches later and 30 books, 16 bestsellers. It’s wild to go back to that story, right? It’s all about a story, as you say. And then knowing that that was where it all began, like wiping tables down, talking to a customer. She thought I just worked there because I was like 30 years old. I looked like a kid wearing a t-shirt and shorts, wiping the table down and just started talking to me. I said, well, I’m actually the owner here. And then I said, that I’m a motivational speaker. That led to that first gig. All right, Steph, I’m going to test you again here. What is your favorite book of all time? Obviously, it’s the Bible, Kevin. Yes. Nailed it. Very good. This time, you didn’t say the book we wrote called You Met Her Where. But it’s still a really good book. That is true. And it would make a great gift for friends or relatives on their birthday or for Christmas. Friends, you can order your copy of our book titled You Met Her Where at kevinandsteph.com. And we will make sure to personally sign a copy for you or whoever you want. And as always, thank you for listening to Tell Us a Good Story. All right, next fun fact. So, John wrote the book, The Energy Bus, in 2006, which came out in 2007. That book, of course, changed he and his family’s life. That book alone has sold over 3 million copies. However, it was not an overnight success.

[19:07] John had 30 publishers tell him no, and not one bookstore in the US would sell it. So, can you share the story of what you did, John, to get your message in front of people because no one was willing to take a chance on you. So after I sold the Mo’s, I’m now focusing on writing and speaking. I knew this is what I truly wanted to do. And I had to let the Mo’s go. This was 2005. Okay. So I had them for like three, four years. So now I sold several Mo’s. I had opened up several and made some money, thankfully, enough to at least carry us as I was going to pursue this writing and speaking career full time. And my wife was like, what happens if it doesn’t work? Like, you’re not really a great speaker or writer. Later, I said, there are no other options. There is no plan B. And so I knew I had to go for it. It’s like burn the boats, right? Yes, burn the ships. Sell the moes. There’s no going back. And this is where I’m going. I am going to focus on writing and speaking 100%. Well, I sell the moes and all of a sudden nothing’s happening. No speaking, things dry up. I’m like in this wilderness and I’m praying and I’m coming to faith during that time. I’m like really coming to faith and just turning to God and tuning into God on my walks of prayer. I’m asking for guidance. I’m asking for help. Money’s running out. Do I have to get a job? Should I just forget this dream?

[20:31] And the energy bus comes to me on this walk. Boom, just pops in my head. The idea, I have a vision for it. And I go right to my home office, which was upstairs. And I began writing this book. And I wrote that book in three and a half weeks and it was magical. It was special. It was the most spiritual experience I’ve ever had in my life was writing that book because literally the story was unfolding and it was like I was taking notes and just typing it. And as it was coming to me, so I thought I had something really special and magical, but then we sent it out to publishers. I was able to find an agent. So that was cool. But it was rejected by over 30 publishers. pushers. So I’m told, no, no, no. What’s an energy bus? We don’t get it. Does it make sense? It’s about a guy who gets on the bus and meets Joy, the bus driver. It wasn’t your traditional business book. It was a combination of business and personal, and no one had ever really combined the two before. You had to be self-development and personal or business, not one that combined them. So those rejections really were scary. There were times I thought my dream was over, it was going to happen, but I literally could not give up because I knew I had something special. I had written something special. And then I’ll never forget, you know, John Wallington’s agreed to publish the book. And so now it’s finally coming out six months later. And I asked a friend, what should I do? And he said, pray.

[22:01] So I prayed for it to be a bestseller. And it came out and it was a bestseller in Korea. I learned you have to be specific with your prayers.

[22:14] Huge hit, huge hit in South Korea, no joke. But not one bookstore in the United States would carry the book, you’re right. So I went on a 28-city tour, paid for myself from city to city, sharing the message in the book. And I didn’t have a huge following. So we were promoting it through local radio stations, emailing at the time just people I knew in the area. We had five people in one city, 10 people in another, 20 in another.

[22:42] The most people we had were 100 people in Des Moines, Iowa. They thought Jeff Gordon was coming, the race car driver. Not John Gordon.

[22:52] And that’s why they show that true story. Like people call me Jeff. I got home and I didn’t know what the future held, but I knew that I had this vision and mission. And that was 2007 when the book came out.

[23:04] And here we are years later and he said the book is now sold over 3 million copies.

[23:09] Changed my life. People started to read it, started to share it, became something that people share with their companies, their schools, their nonprofits, their teams, their families. It just really is some kind of book that everyone just shares and it just continues to get more and more popular even now more than last year, more than the year before. So it’s been a really huge blessing and a huge change in my life. And I’m just so appreciative that I was the one that got a chance to steward and share that book with the world. Okay. I have a question for you because listening to you speak, you’re a man of faith, but it was been a low season for you when you were trying to get the book off the, off the ground, you know, your best seller in South Korea, you’ve already sold your most, you’re seeing 10 people, five people. Some people didn’t even want to see you. They want to see Jeff. Where were you mentally? And then where was your faith in all of this? Well, that was where I really learned real positivity because I had written this story about a guy who has to overcome negativity and challenges to define himself and ultimately create his future. And that was me. I was literally living my own story that I had written, and I had to stay positive on this tour. I had to stay positive sharing the message. I had to remember it wasn’t about me. Like, come on, John, you said it was about one person at a time. Make a difference one person at a time. Even if six people are there, make a difference one person at a time. And you know what’s so cool? One event, there were six people.

[24:37] One of those people was Betty Palm. She was working for a company at the time. Years later, over 10 years later, she became president of Avon and remembered the impact I had on her at that talk and brought me in to speak to 6,000 people for Big Event at Avon. So I look back on that and was like.

[24:58] I was being taught to live the vision, live the mission, do it one person at a time, do it for the right reason. You learn humility, you learn character and resilience. And to this day, I don’t have a big head. I don’t get too big for myself because I know the journey I’ve been on. I know what it took to get here. And I’m just so thankful. I’m so thankful because I went through the grind and the fire. As I told my daughter, you will have to go through it. And I’m doing this for the right reasons. Even to this day, I make sure that I really focus on the message, making a difference, who I’m reaching, and make sure that every event I do, I bring my best. It’s like Joe DiMaggio said, there’s always some kid seeing me for the first time. I owe him my best.

[25:47] So John, we live here in Columbus, Ohio. So Steph, back in August of 2016, he’s already laughing. I’m laughing at Columbus because one of my less than stellar performances happened in Columbus, Ohio.

[26:00] Oh, yeah. I didn’t know that. Talk about a story. I go to speak to these educators. And right before I go on, they show a video of a young man who passed away from cancer. And he’s sharing how teachers impacted him and his story. I’m a wreck. Oh, no. And they want me to then speak on the energy bus and about positivity and uplifting everyone. It was the worst time and the worst message. And I usually rise above. I’ve never not risen above. This was the only time I think in my thousands of speeches that I was just truly wrecked from that experience of seeing that young man. And then his parents were there. And so I was trying to weave that, seeing his parents, seeing his son. And then back to the energy bus, but not be too positive about it. It was definitely one of the strangest moments of my life. And it happened in Columbus. But so when you said Columbus, but I did speak to the Columbus Blue Jackets. Oh, you did? Okay. Yes.

[27:00] And I really, I really liked them. Obviously they didn’t have a good season this year, but, but I really do like them a lot. Yes.

[27:06] Okay. So another good thing happened in Columbus, Ohio. Oh, that’s good. Yes. He has something positive to say here. Okay. His very first Ted talk was in Columbus, Ohio in August of 2016. Here’s what’s crazy. We’ve talked to people who have done Ted talks before. They practice this for months, rehearsing, practicing it, being on stage. John here was given a two hour notice.

[27:30] Two hours. So can you share that story, how that happened, John? Cause that’s incredible. If you find my Ted talk online, you’ll know that it was very spontaneous. Cause I actually share that in the talk about what happened when I arrived. I had just spoken to the San Francisco 49ers during training camp and I didn’t get much sleep the night before. And I arrived in Columbus and everyone’s wearing these Ted shirts and they were picking me up. I’m like, what are you wearing in the Ted shirts for? Oh, we’re having a Ted event today. You speak tomorrow at the conference. We’re using the same place to do our Ted event. And then tomorrow is the educators conference. They said, one of our speakers didn’t show up. Would you want to speak today? And I’m like, no, I have not prepared.

[28:19] And I didn’t get any sleep the night before. And I spoke to the 49ers and a bunch of the coaches and players wanted to talk to me and ask me questions. And I was giving advice. So again, I was talked to. So we’re driving to the hotel. They’re taking me to the hotel and then they were going to go to the event. And on the way to the hotel, this thought came to me, John, remember your mission to inspire as many people as possible. One person at a time. Are you living your vision and mission? If you don’t do this, I said to them, how many people were going to be there, about 400. I said, all right, I’ll do it. Let’s go. And so they brought me to my hotel. I changed into my suit because I was like in a t-shirt and shorts, I think, and changed my suit and boom, we went there and I literally gave a talk on the surprising secrets of success. And you could hear my voice during the talk that it was definitely scratchy. I was a little nasally. I wasn’t feeling great, but it turned out pretty well. And what’s fun is it was spontaneous so I was actually less nervous because it was just winging it let’s go for it nothing to lose no fear and I gave that TED talk.

[29:33] Isn’t it wild okay okay okay truth obviously it was like god telling you hey john yeah you know you’re saying you’re aligning your steps you’re like dang it god yeah but do i really want don’t you know i’m tired god like for did you wrestle it or you’re like okay god here we go let’s do it oh it was it was exactly that conversation no i don’t want to do this no i’m exhausted i mean my first reaction was no i don’t want to do this job but then i’m like i have to do this like i’m really going to live the vision and mission. And I wasn’t even thinking about the video part of it. To me, it was about the people that were in the audience to be able to reach them. Yeah. And that’s what drove me to do it. For sure.

[30:13] If you like what you hear, please tell someone about us. As soon as this episode is over, go tell your spouse, your closest friend, a parent, a coworker, or share one of our posts on social media. However, if you don’t like what you’re hearing, please do not. Don’t tell anyone. Don’t tell anyone. Don’t tell anybody. Just disregard this message. Don’t worry about it. Forget about us. Go on with your merry day. And to get more information about us or our entire catalog of episodes, be sure to check us out at kevinandsteph.com. Thank you for listening to tell us a good story.

[30:43] All right. Final fun fact here. John has now written 30 books, including two that will come out this year. I think one just did. The list includes 16 bestsellers, five children’s books. I read a quote here from you, John, that says each book I’ve written takes about three weeks. I give all the credit to God. He’s the author. I’m the pen. So can you talk about your books that are coming out in that quote? Because that’s very powerful. I didn’t even know that I could write a fable or even write books like that until I wrote The Energy Bus. And again, I wrote that book in about three, three and a half weeks, and it was divine inspiration. And then I was able to do it again with the no complaining rule and training camp. I wrote The Shark and the Goldfish on an airplane going to Las Vegas to speak. Oh my gosh. Out of my BlackBerry. So I wrote that one there and then was able to fine tune it afterwards. But I’ve written most books, yeah, three and a half to four weeks is the latest.

[31:41] And I get the idea, I get the vision, I know what it’s supposed to be. And then as I begin writing, it just begins to write itself. So I know I’m really not the author. I really give credit to the ultimate creator, the ultimate writer, the ultimate author. And then I’m just basically trying to surrender and trust and be a conduit for what I’m meant to write. And musicians will tell you all the time, like the song just comes to them. The words just come, the melody just comes. And in so many ways, when I’m writing, that’s what’s happening. It’s really when I’m probably happiest is when I’m writing. So to me, it’s about writer first, then speaking. And I love telling stories. And I really believe we’re meant to go through challenges and struggles to become who we’re meant to become so that we can impact others. And when you live that way, it becomes a very powerful and amazing, magical story. Lori.

[32:35] Well, listeners, for more information about John, you can go to his website, JohnGordon.com for his books, his newsletter, his podcast, which now has, Steph, 383 episodes. And his Facebook page is John Gordon Page. His Instagram is at JohnGordon11. And we will put links to that in our show notes on our website. So you can click on that and go right to those pages. Perfect. And that’s J-O-N Gordon. Yes. J-O-N. Yes. Thank you. well john thank you so much for giving us your time here you’re amazing to talk to like you said an amazing storyteller as well so thank you for saying yes to us thanks john well thank you both for just doing an incredible podcast and doing all your research you know that that separates you from all the other people doing these interviews you’ve done your homework and and you really get to know your people and that makes it more fun and then you bring out the stories which is what it’s all about so you all have done amazing i’ve done a lot of podcasts you are exceptional Shut up, Kevin.

[33:39] Oh, babe. Thank you, John. Thanks, John. Oh, babe, are you freaking out right now? That’s very kind. That is so amazing. Good job, babe. Thanks, John. Kevin’s awesome. Keep up the great work. I see you did a really amazing job. Great job, Kevin. Thank you. Friends, we want to encourage you to please follow us wherever you listen to this, whether it’s on the Apple Podcast app, iHeartRadio, Spotify, or one of the other platforms. You guys, it’s completely free. And while you’re there, feel free to give us a rating or a nice review. Thank you for listening to Tell Us a Good Story.